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Marriages Mar 1893
Martin Charles John St. Olave 1d 372
Perkins Sarah Ann St. Olave 1d 372

Bertie W Martin (my grandad) was married in 1932 and his father was listed on the marriage cert as being deceased at that time. It could have been that Charles John Martin was older when my grandfather was born and that would explain why he was deceased at the time of my grandads marriage.

They were about the same age.

Name: Charles John Martin
Age: 21
Estimated birth year: abt 1872
Spouse Name: Sarah Ann Perkins
Spouse Age: 20
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 19 Mar 1893
Parish: Saint Katharine, Rotherhithe
County: Middlesex
Borough: Southwark
Father Name: William Henry Martin
Spouse Father Name: George James Perkins

There are infinite number of reasons that his father was deceased at such an early age, his job, his health.... his lifestyle. He was a Cooper according to his marriage cert, maybe he had an accident at work?

I should also add, your Grandfather maybe have been older when he married?

If Charles was 21 in 1893 that makes him born c 1872 and therefore 50 years of age when his own son married. Time took it's toll alot more than it does today.

My money would be on a work accident or early onset of ill health.

Tracey x

If they remained in the same place, this could be his death

Name: Charles J Martin
Death Registration Month/Year: 1924 (jul-aug-sept)
Age at death (estimated): 50
Registration district: Edmonton
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume: 3a
Page: 443

You people are just so wonderful!!
You have no idea what this information means to me and my dad.
How can I best go about finding more information on my dads fathers side?
Thank you so much again xx

Ahhh i have found you!!

OK well the first step has already been made by yourself, and that was returning to your thread.

Without your constant presence to feed information off we struggle. It's difficult to know what people want from information.

Do you feel you have all the data you need, or is there more we can assist with??

Does your father have siblings he's lost contact with? Do you want to go further backwards? Baptism records etc and relatively easy to find for the London area as long as a child was actually Baptised.

Currently there is a website that has London baptisms to 1906, marriages to 1921 and burial's into the 1980's.

Please let us know what other data you need, there is a wealth of knownledge available to you through the help here. We *should* be able to help you further.


Tracey xx

Oh again, thank you so much :) Wow this is amazing.
I would like to find out more about my dad's uncle William Henry Martin (b 1901). My dad said William was killed on board HMS Kelly in WW2. He was a stoker 1st class - Service number c/ss 12448.
We don't have a great deal of information on dad's fathers elder siblings but my dad would love to find out if they had any children he could contact.
I would like to try and trace as far back as I can on Charles John Martins side.
Where do I start looking? Do I have to join and pay for membership somewhere to access this information?

How can I find out which of my dad's fathers siblings served during the war?
I have tried to do a search on their names and entered WW2 but no results on google.
Thank you.

I would also like to know how I can find out the names of the children of my grandfathers siblings? This may help me to track down any living relatives.
Thank you kindly.

Oh heavens, google won't find you any of that!

First, WWII records are still not released publicly, as being personal info about possibly living people and thus covered by privacy legislation.

If any of them died, the death will be commemorated here

http://www.cwgc.org/debt_of_honour.asp?menuid=14

where names are searchable. Unfortunately the efforts to install a better search engine recently didn't work so searching there - by surname and initials only - can be tedious.

Name: MARTIN, WILLIAM HENRY
Initials: W H
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Stoker 1st Class
Regiment/Service: Royal Navy
Unit Text: H.M.S. Kelly
Age: 47
Date of Death: 23/05/1941
Service No: C/SS 124458
Additional information: Son of Charles and Sarah Martin; husband of Eva Martin, of Edmonton, London.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: 47, 3.
Memorial: CHATHAM NAVAL MEMORIAL

For the siblings, you have to find their marriages. Very fortunately you have middle initials from the 1911 census, but the names could still be common.

Search for their marriages at FreeBMD.

Then once you have a spouse's surname, search for births in the husband's surname with the wife's surname as mother's surname.

http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl

It's something we can help with, but the searches are the same whether you do them or someone else does them and it's more fun to do it yourself!



......................... or someone else will just do your searching for you .........................

Thank you Janey.
Yes I prefer to search myself as it is indeed more fun finding out this information. I just need to know where to start searching and what search engines are best.
Thnkyou so much to all of you:)

This goes with the death Linda has found for you...

On 23 May 1941, during the evacuation of Crete, Kelly was bombed and sunk, with half her crew killed. Kelly did succeed in shooting down one of the attacking Stukas immediately, while another was badly damaged and crashed upon returning to base.[4] The survivors were deeply affected by the loss of their ship; Mountbatten shared their loss and tried to console the ship's company by reminding them all that "we didn't leave the Kelly, the Kelly left us!"

...and a pic of her.

http://uboat.net/allies/warships/ship/4455.html

Seems Lord Louis Mountbatten was her Captain when she was sunk!

Depending how long William was on her for this might be a useful site...

http://www.naval-history.net/xGM-Chrono-10DD-38K-Kelly.htm

Tracey x

Thank you Tracey for that info about the HMS Kelly. I had a read and indeed it was under the command of Lord Mountbatten. My dad confirmed this when I spoke to him. I remember years ago a film made about this ship.

I h ave been trying to find marriages for William and his siblings but have only managed to locate Minnie Sarah Martin's marriage to John Bell. There don't seem to be any marriage listings that I can find for them on FreeBMD.

Thank you :)

Peter,
Thank you for your help.
I did find the same possible children for Minnie Sophia and John Bell today while searching BMD but that was all I could find. I couldn't find marriages for the others or children.
I think that the William and Eva marriage you found could be the right one.
Thank you again :)

Peter,
My dad seems to think that perhaps Eva's maiden name was Labourne or Laben. He is not positive though as he was just a child when he knew them.

What is the latest census that we can check? Is it 1901 or 1911?
Thank you.

It's 1911 and you've already had that (page 1)

Tracey x

Tracey,
I have tried to access the 1911 census to find out about Eva Wackett b 1907 and her family (or household members) but all I keep getting is her alone. They keep saying I need to purchase credits ??? Do I have to join one of these things to access the household names?

Ahhhhh, for the Wackett household, i was going to say someone will find it, if they don't i'll have a look....

The 1911 census is a credit based site, the search is free but to find other members is the paid bit. There is a work around to find other members of the hosuehold.....and still not pay.

In your case you now have the data you need.


Tracey x